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calling all linux lovers... - 3/9/2010 7:52:44 AM
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keithyhuntington
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so i have an old laptop... optimised for windows 98, but i am currently running xp on it so i can have wireless... the laptop is slow as mollasses though (it really needs 98 on it... but as far as i've searched, 98 is not compatible with wireless cards)
so question... is there a linux that would be alot easier on the slow processor and small ram? (ie, not a recourse hog)
would it have the ability to run wireless?
do you think it would be easy to integrate it into my network for pc2pc file sharing with my windows 7 desktop?
and pretty much all this computer is used for is an internet box... i am partial to firefox... can i run firefox on linux?
so what say ye?
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RE: calling all linux lovers... - 3/9/2010 8:46:08 AM
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keithyhuntington
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quote:
ORIGINAL: neuronstatic
Can you post the specs? What speed CPU, how much memory, does it have USB 2.0, etc...
I run Xubuntu on an only 600 MHz Toshiba laptop with only 384 MB RAM. It is quite usable but video playback from youtube is stinky.
I have other suggestions as well.
SPECS later this morning. i'm not at home. youtube stinky, huh? may be a deal breaker for the wife :-/
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RE: calling all linux lovers... - 3/9/2010 8:57:04 AM
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neuronstatic
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I believe youtube is stinky on that laptop because the CPU is itty bitty and the ram is teeny weeny. If I let them queue up entirely, or download them, playback is pretty good.
I run Xubuntu on a more capable box and everything is fine.
For distros on small systems, I have also had luck with Puppy Linux and Damn Small Linux.
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RE: calling all linux lovers... - 3/9/2010 10:11:38 AM
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mrtigger
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quote:
ORIGINAL: keithyhuntington
so i have an old laptop... optimised for windows 98, but i am currently running xp on it so i can have wireless... the laptop is slow as mollasses though (it really needs 98 on it... but as far as i've searched, 98 is not compatible with wireless cards)
so question... is there a linux that would be alot easier on the slow processor and small ram? (ie, not a recourse hog)
would it have the ability to run wireless?
do you think it would be easy to integrate it into my network for pc2pc file sharing with my windows 7 desktop?
and pretty much all this computer is used for is an internet box... i am partial to firefox... can i run firefox on linux?
so what say ye?
I run Redhat 9 on my 400Mhz, 128Mbyte RAM laptop. It runs a full desktop. It is a bit sluggish but usable. (Although note that it would be difficult to even find that distro anymore...)
As Linux has progressed, newer versions use up more and more RAM & CPU.. I do not think my laptop would run anything later than RedHat 9 (circa 2003) satisfactorily.
You may be able to run with a recent Linux with a lot of tweaking and maybe a lightweight display manager. I have not gone through that exercise myself however.
Firefox definitely runs on Linux.
Wireless -- I'm not sure of. The only wireless Linux box I run is my PS3. I have heard that wireless support is spotty in Linux but maybe someone knows more definitively than me on the topic.
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RE: calling all linux lovers... - 3/9/2010 12:08:56 PM
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keithyhuntington
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ok specs as promised:
laptop is a Del Inspirion 7000
intel pentium II 366 mhz processor
128 mb sdram
xp is alright on here... but it can take quite a while to pull up applications (we really only use it for web surf, email, and an occasional itunes download or whatever) and some word composition as well.
wireless is a must, it has no modems
and integration with win7 is a must, because we swap files back and forth from here and the desktop (depending whos on what, and whos doing what)
so yeah... anything that would run this more satisfactorily than xp, and have wireless support?
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RE: calling all linux lovers... - 3/10/2010 1:21:19 AM
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keithyhuntington
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i know. i tried to change my avatar, but CW goofed up. so i was like "eehhhh stuff it."
and as i said, the computer has no modems. it has an ethernet 'port' but theres nothing in it. its missing a card. i don't know if it came that way from teh store? or if the previous owner took out the ethernet card. i'll look again... but if i remember correctly i shined a light in there and it was just a dark hole. i just use a wireless slide in card thingy on the expansion ports.
i'll try the bootable thing this weekend maybe... but the computer is formatted in fat32... and i dont know if thats why.. or if its another reason... but it doesnt boot from a cd drive, it only boots from teh floppy. to instal an OS i have to put in a dos boot disk and get a prompt, and then instal cd support drivers. would it still work that way? (im saying this cause i'm just assuming it would be a file too big for a floppy disk)
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RE: calling all linux lovers... - 3/10/2010 6:58:41 AM
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DaveW
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quote:
(im saying this cause i'm just assuming it would be a file too big for a floppy disk) Puppy linux should fit on a floppy. D*mn small Linux definately fits on a floppy.
I used to have a dell laptop also. They had non-standard video cards on a lot of the older laptops and the only linux I could get to run on it was an early version of Vector Linux, not a well known distro. That could give you problems. Definately boot from the floppy to try it out before changing anything.
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RE: calling all linux lovers... - 3/10/2010 9:05:45 AM
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keithyhuntington
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oh ok. thanks. will try maybe this weekend if i'm bored =)
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RE: calling all linux lovers... - 3/11/2010 7:58:39 AM
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keithyhuntington
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well, i looked into this a little bit online. and downloaded the OS cd but i am a little bit apprehensive about the whole thing. mainly because i'm so used to windows/dos and i can't fathom using anything else.
kinda like on The Matrix when they have to take their first breath of oxygen.
but how would i make a LIVE boot floppy? teh boot disk ISO i dl'ed at puppylinux.com was like 100 mb. i unpacked it... but couldnt make any sense of the actual files. any hints on this?
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RE: calling all linux lovers... - 3/11/2010 8:21:55 AM
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neuronstatic
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None of the distributions really fit on a floppy anymore. There are some custom ones still in existence, but they are specifically targeted to a task. For example, a single floppy disk distro to run a straightforward firewall and nothing else. But what you can do is create the boot disk for Linux on a floppy and then install from that point.
There are instructions online for bringing up a Linux box from floppy. When I get a chance today, I will try to find the right one to point you to. Its about the same as booting DOS. You make a bootable floppy that has a minimal kernel to allow you to load CD and network drivers. And then you run the installer. I am not sure if it is doing a chain boot at that point or simply running the installer.
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RE: calling all linux lovers... - 3/11/2010 10:08:14 AM
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keithyhuntington
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Well that's all fine and good. Is there anyway to run the puppy without overwriting windows (a live disk) just to test how the wireless and monitor may or may not work?
edit: i think i found the floppy version... would this be it at the bottom?
edit edit: nevermind... i didnt move the decimal enough spaces in my head :P
< Message edited by keithyhuntington -- 3/11/2010 10:28:54 AM >
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RE: calling all linux lovers... - 3/11/2010 1:57:09 PM
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neuronstatic
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Ok, I have been looking into installing Linux from floppy.
Yes, it can be done.
No, you are probably not going to get it done on that machine as it is.
I know you can get a running kernel on that machine from floppy boot, but you will not have wireless, wired ethernet only. But if you had wired ethernet, you could then boot from floppy and then begin installing the rest from the Internet. This is something that is non-trivial.
According to the specs for the 7000, you should be able to go into BIOS and change the boot order manually to get it to boot from CD. But if that doesn't work, its a non-starter for getting nearly anything else on there.
Sorry.
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RE: calling all linux lovers... - 3/11/2010 5:31:59 PM
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DaveW
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You might want to check this distro out:
http://www.desktoplinux.com/news/NS2501946250.html
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Our CD is available here:
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RE: calling all linux lovers... - 3/12/2010 6:07:48 AM
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keithyhuntington
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yeah, heres teh proverbial slap in the face. so i looked at it, and it only has an analogue dial-up modem. i thought it was ethernet, but its not. nix that idea totally of using the wire.
i figured out how to get to the bios and set-up the boot order. i thought it was 'del', but it turns out its 'F2'. i havent done it yet. but i'll see if i can set all boots to cd and see if it does anything. if not i'll have to have a boot floppy.
i'll try it out... if it doesnt work... i've had this debate before... but forgot how it ended...
isnt the main difference between NTFS and FAT that on NTFS there is no dos prompt? or is that just strictly an OEM issue, and all OEMs just happen to be running NTFS?
if i were to just re-format it NTFS, would it then run off the cd-rom boot?
this sounds all weird, but i'm just making up logic as i go along :P my computers have always been set up FAT because i like the idea of every few months sticking in a floppy, typing "format c:" and re-installing the OS to get rid of any clutter and clean it up. i've heard on NTFS you cannot do this... because it bypasses the dos boot order or something. and i've tried to run Boot cds on my FAT pcs, but they have never ran on my computers, i've set up all 4 boots to cd on my desktops, and they usually just disregard the cd in the drive. so in my head i just assume that NTFS runs boot cds only, and FAT runs boot floppies only... am i overthinking that though?
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RE: calling all linux lovers... - 3/12/2010 6:30:24 AM
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DaveW
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Booting from the CD rom drive is not a function of what is or is not on your hard drive. That is purely a function of the BIOS setup.
All versions of WIN have a dos prompt command line. FORMAT C: would work no matter what version you were using. The earlier versions (and DOS) will have limits on the size of hard drive they will format.
Does the laptop have a pcmcia port?
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Avatar is my son Caleb and Leah on their wedding 12/20/09
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Winner of 2010 "best in "He Says"
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Our CD is available here:
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RE: calling all linux lovers... - 3/12/2010 7:31:05 AM
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keithyhuntington
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quote:
ORIGINAL: DaveW
Does the laptop have a pcmcia port?
it has 2.... one with the wireless, and one empty.
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RE: calling all linux lovers... - 3/12/2010 9:03:37 AM
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neuronstatic
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quote:
ORIGINAL: keithyhuntington
isnt the main difference between NTFS and FAT that on NTFS there is no dos prompt? or is that just strictly an OEM issue, and all OEMs just happen to be running NTFS?
if i were to just re-format it NTFS, would it then run off the cd-rom boot?
this sounds all weird, but i'm just making up logic as i go along :P my computers have always been set up FAT because i like the idea of every few months sticking in a floppy, typing "format c:" and re-installing the OS to get rid of any clutter and clean it up. i've heard on NTFS you cannot do this... because it bypasses the dos boot order or something. and i've tried to run Boot cds on my FAT pcs, but they have never ran on my computers, i've set up all 4 boots to cd on my desktops, and they usually just disregard the cd in the drive. so in my head i just assume that NTFS runs boot cds only, and FAT runs boot floppies only... am i overthinking that though?
NTFS and FAT are file system formats, not execution environments. FAT and FAT32 have been around a long time. I would guess that you are probably running FAT32 on your Win9x system(s). FAT has also found its way on to a myriad of small devices, like mp3 players, as well.
NTFS was introduced by Microsoft with NT and has superseded FAT as the Windows file system. If you bring up a band new XP, Vista or Win7 box, it will use NTFS as its file system format.
Its not an OEM thing, its how Windows works.
A file system format is simply how the OS organizes blocks of data on the disk to create chains of blocks to store files in. It has no bearing on the computer booting from other media, or on how the boot proceeds on the OS at all.
On any Windows installation, at least from XP on, you can boot from CD and repair or reinstall the operating system, which I believe is what you are trying to accomplish with boot from floppy and format c: to reinstall. Unless you are still running DOS or Win9x (or Win 3.1) there is no reason to try to remain on the FAT file system for your system disk.
Ok, there is one exception. If you multi-boot another operating system that cannot read NTFS and you need access to the FAT formatted partition. But the only desktop operating systems that can't read NTFS aren't supported anymore either. You can read and write NTFS partitions from Linux, BSD, and OS X. In fact, I just looked and found a NTFS read/write utility for DOS.
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RE: calling all linux lovers... - 3/12/2010 9:14:01 AM
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keithyhuntington
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interesting... then why the heck could i never boot from a cd on my XP comp running Fat? it just flat wouldnt. it'll boot from a win 98 floppy fine. but i could not for teh life of me get it to boot from an xp boot cd. i just shucked it up to "must be how the system is set up, partaining to the alocation table" cause that was the only difference between my computer (non oem) and my mom's computer (oem) that i could think of in comparison.
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RE: calling all linux lovers... - 3/12/2010 9:50:18 AM
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DaveW
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quote:
ORIGINAL: keithyhuntingtonquote:
ORIGINAL: DaveW
Does the laptop have a pcmcia port? It has 2.... one with the wireless, and one empty. If you plan on continuing to use this machine (and seeing that the ethernet port is missing) I would suggest scouring the web to find a pcmcia ethernet card. I used to have one on a very old laptop and it worked fine.
Tigerdirect has 3 in their catalog starting at $20.
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Avatar is my son Caleb and Leah on their wedding 12/20/09
=======================
Winner of 2010 "best in "He Says"
=======================
Our CD is available here:
http://cdbaby.com/cd/dswaggoner
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RE: calling all linux lovers... - 3/12/2010 12:04:13 PM
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neuronstatic
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quote:
ORIGINAL: keithyhuntington
interesting... then why the heck could i never boot from a cd on my XP comp running Fat? it just flat wouldnt. it'll boot from a win 98 floppy fine. but i could not for teh life of me get it to boot from an xp boot cd. i just shucked it up to "must be how the system is set up, partaining to the alocation table" cause that was the only difference between my computer (non oem) and my mom's computer (oem) that i could think of in comparison.
Don't know. We CD boot XP machines running NTFS all the time to repair or reload them. And we never changed the file systems. They all defaulted to NTFS. I have multiple times booted an XP CD on an old Win9x machine that was FAT formatted to upgrade to XP. Never had an issue related to file system.
Each and every time I had issues related to CD booting, it was a BIOS issue with order, driver, or some other odd thing in the BIOS.
So when you say "wouldn't boot from the CD", do you mean any and all CDs? That is certainly not related to the file system format of the hard disk.
Now is it possible that you had a funky machine that kept part of its BIOS on disk and you over-wrote it with a format? Some older machines used to keep some BIOS code on disk. That could cause problems, especially if the device drivers got smashed.
But regardless of how the disk partitioning, allocation, or format is set up, that normally has no bearing on booting from a CD - except in the case of the BIOS keeping driver code on the disk and it gets wiped out.
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RE: calling all linux lovers... - 3/12/2010 12:46:02 PM
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keithyhuntington
Posts: 1128
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quote:
ORIGINAL: DaveW
quote:
ORIGINAL: keithyhuntingtonquote:
ORIGINAL: DaveW
Does the laptop have a pcmcia port? It has 2.... one with the wireless, and one empty. If you plan on continuing to use this machine (and seeing that the ethernet port is missing) I would suggest scouring the web to find a pcmcia ethernet card. I used to have one on a very old laptop and it worked fine.
Tigerdirect has 3 in their catalog starting at $20.
yeah. its been on pcmcia wifi... thats the only way i get online :) thats why i said i want a smaller OS that can run wifi. i'd do windows 98 if i can find a wifi patch or something. i've just heard it doesnt have teh capability out of box.
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RE: calling all linux lovers... - 3/12/2010 1:22:55 PM
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DaveW
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quote:
ORIGINAL: neuronstatic
But regardless of how the disk partitioning, allocation, or format is set up, that normally has no bearing on booting from a CD - except in the case of the BIOS keeping driver code on the disk and it gets wiped out.
But would that not produce a lot more problems than just not booting from the optical drive? I would think it would scriew up booting from a floppy as well.
It is possible on a machine that old that booting from a CD was not available. Perhaps a firmware update (if they had that available then) might fix it. I know they had that and then stopped for a while due to viruses embedding themselves in the cmos; and then started again once they fixed that problem.
_____________________________
Avatar is my son Caleb and Leah on their wedding 12/20/09
=======================
Winner of 2010 "best in "He Says"
=======================
Our CD is available here:
http://cdbaby.com/cd/dswaggoner
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